Skull Skates
Words by Alan Ng
Photography by Jarvis Ho
These are the words by Skull Skates owner Peter Ducommun, or simply P.D.. Skull Skates is an internationally recognized skateboarding brand that started out in Saskatchewan. A little while later, Skull Skates found a new home in Vancouver but soon moved down to the L.A.. Eventually, this skateboarding brand found its way back Vancouver where it remained. When the justalilhype! Crew met P.D. for the first time, it was as if we were talking to a skateboarding godfather and this veteran had the wisdom to follow. Read on to see the 5000 words P.D. gave us of the history on Skull Skates and wisdom about the game.
Please introduce yourself to our readers.
I am P.D. and I started Skull Skates in 1978 and P.D.’s hot shop in 1976.
Skull Skates, can you tell us more about it?
Skull Skates started off at Regina Saskatchewan out of all places, I live here in Vancouver at the time when my brother was 10 years older than me. He was living in Regina. How we got started and even sell skateboards was he would sell these iron on T-Shirts, I don’t even know man, Canadian beer and all those kind of designs. He introduced me into skating because he had been skating since the 60’s. So, he was going to California to pick up iron on T-Shirt designs and I would go with him and pick up skate gear and friends would ask me to go help them pick up these set of wheels for them. When I started doing that I realized… Shit, there are really no people selling skateboards in Canada and we can do this. So that’s was the start of P.D’s hot shop.
Skull Skates was basically selling people‘s stuff and feeling like I can design something a little bit better than this, you know? If I made this shape a little longer and drill out the width here, people could skate better. That’s where Skull Skates came up, where I was having this urge to design and ride my own stuff.
Can you tell us about the first skate that you have designed?
Right from the beginning, to this date in fact… we always prototype everything and test it. We never make a design and go straight into production. Even if it’s just a small adjustment to a design, we would always test them. So the first one really that really took off was the GNC pipe cleaner if I remembered correctly. Pretty funny name! – Obviously played on riding pipes. So at that point we didn’t have the Skull Skates logo yet, we were using the GNC, abbreviation for Great North Country. Of course we burned the Ying & Yang from the Town and Country surf designs out of Hawaii and of course they burned it because it’s an ancient symbol that goes way back. Even our logo, the skull and the Skull Skates, the way that one side is shaded and the other is all highlighted, the idea from that is taken from Ying and Yang too.
We got the first broad that was probably the pipe cleaner and like I said, the process stays the same till this day. I come up for an idea for something and I design a lot, or Skull Skates has put out a lot of stuff outside of skateboarding too. So like, within skateboarding, we do tech broads, transition broads, long boarders, all kind of stuff like that- and then we do skim broads, snow broads, bicycles, it’s all stuff that I am really into, and my friends that are into. When you are stoked on something then of course, you start to think. I guess in my mind, I am a designer in nature so I look at stuff and go like that’s really cool, and it would just be a little cooler if it’s just like this you know?
What got you to move out from Regina to here?
I never really lived there, my brother had lived there so the brand started there because he was the dude that had the dough and could sign the agreements and shit because I was a kid still, so I couldn’t really do that stuff. Probably a year later he ended up moving to Vancouver so I kept it going from 1979-1980 and by 1983-1984, we relocated to LA. Back in those days it was different. Now you can start a skateboard brand and run it anywhere because of the things like web presence and what not, you don’t really need to be in a specific area but in those days, to make a splash internationally, you really have to be located in Southern California, so that’s what we did. We set up in LA and a lot of people that had supported us prior to that knew we were from Canada and some people just thought it was a California based company like so many others out there at that time. I ended up staying at LA for about 5 years, I got back to Vancouver at 1989-1990 and my partner stayed in LA for another 3 or 4 years. I moved back to Canada because, well I like LA too but it’s nothing compared to Vancouver. I mean there’s great things about L.A and for me, I am not inclined to any gangsterism and yet I have always worn black clothing, I like it and it was comfortable- but when I lived in LA, you have a look and dudes were getting in your face, trying to ask you what set you are claiming and stuff and I was like, you know I don’t even know which saved my ass… The dude had this weapon in my face, I was like okay, what the fuck was going to happen here and by me just going “I was from Canada and I didn’t know what their rules was and shit.
(Everyone laughs)
Dude was like, you alright boy. Shakes my hands and told me I shouldn’t be down there if I didn’t know anybody in the neighbour hood. So that actually happened to me a few times. Dudes just pulling up on me and showing me their pieces, I just say “Dude, I am not even involved, I’m from Canada, didn’t know…” and what happens is that Canada doesn’t broader on any tuff in LA because as far as they are concerned, it was like from another country so that was sort of like get out of jail free.
Yea that’s the thing about L.A, you go to some gnarly neighbourhood or places where manufacturing was done. 3 times a week I would have to go to these gnarly neighbourhoods you know. And so coming out of Canada, from the early 80s, you had the bikers but you didn’t have the gang culture. I mean I found it interesting. For example if you look at LA gang graffiti it’s very different than anything else out there, the whole style of it, it’s got a traditional where it goes back to the 50’s. I found that very interesting but the rest of it, having them not wanting to kill you just being in those neighbourhoods, I didn’t really feel that too much you know? I understand the concept of it but I obviously don’t co sign it.
Moving back to Vancouver… was like fresh air. Dudes aren’t trying to shoot your windows up because you accidentally cut them off on the free way and stuff. More relaxed kind of life style and that works with me.
Skateboarding is your dogma, how have you implemented this into Skull Skates?
Well Skull Skates is obviously a company and what a company does is it exists to generate money and turn to profit and stay in business. That part of it is like any other company. I think what makes Skull Skates different is that…
This sounds hella corny but I am just going to let it rip anyway. Most people want to sell you a skateboard but when I sell you a skateboard, I want you to become a skateboarder, I want you to feel it like how me and my friends feel and so, of course, we want you to buy one of our broads but we are not going to hate on you if you buy someone else’s broad, the point is to get people skating and get them to keep on skating.
You know, for myself I wasn’t like a super bad kid. But you know when you are a kid, you are a little stupid. And discovering skateboarding for me was a very important thing for me because it gave me a focus and discipline. And much like graph or b-boying and any kinds of these things, it’s like you. Yea, it’s a confidence deal, you go like that’s a really fucking difficult thing to do, but if I put a shit load of effort into it, I am actually going to pull it and I am going to add my own style to it. So when you accomplish that, it’s a great thing.
I think there’s another thing about skateboarding which is a very simple lesson that most people learn is, if you become a skate broader for life is that, best lesson you ever learn from skateboarding is…. when you fall, get back up. That’s pretty simple, but that’s a good thing in life man because you are going to get knocked down here and there and the point is to get up and keep going.
Was there one point in time where you got knocked down and didn’t want to get back up?
On skateboarding ? Like injury you mean?
Both.
Well life, yea. Life is one of those things, of course. I mean skateboarding wise. I got a metal plate attached screws on my left ankle, I’ve got a metal pipe going from my knee to my right ankle also attached with screws. I also had a lot of other injuries that didn’t involve screws and plates. The thing about skateboarding is that if you are not falling down, you are not skateboarding; you are going to eat shit a whole bunch. I don’t know, anytime you get stoked in something, say your into graph and your into hitting roof tops and doing draw ups, well you know the parallels. Dogs can bite your ass, you fall off of something and fucking die, and get chased and arrested. When you are stoked, none of that really makes a difference because your focus is getting up, you know?
That’s skateboarding too man, if your focus is being a skater, you just do what you do. Do what you need to do to continue skateboarding.
And far as life goes, yea of course man, I’ve played with all kinds of drugs and you know, I don’t regret any of that stuff but we all have friends that have taken paths that probably are not the best ones you know? Things like drug abuse and drug addiction. I think in the skating world you got all kinds of people; from gnarly people, to pretty low-key people to everything in between. Part of the skateboarding life style is also part of the rock star kind of thing. Especially if you are a sponsored well known person, so it’s easy to slide in those I am just going to get fucked up and not sleep kind of thing. It sounds kind of glamorous but it’s actually a pretty beat lifestyle if you get into it.
Personally, I’ve been through that stuff, I don’t regret it because I am not curious on what that lifestyle is like. You know? But I wouldn’t do it again.
I think if I didn’t have a skateboard and got into drugs and booze and partying and not sleeping and shit. Then I probably would have just kept going that way. But a skateboard kind of keeps you grounded, if you get too fucked up and don’t get enough sleep, you won’t be able to sleep. If you can’t skate, then what’s the fucking point of getting up, you know?
Skull and Skates… skateboarding is known to most people especially at the 90s as a rebellious act, especially with the notion of tying skate boarders with graffiti and petty crimes… why did you choose the “Skull” to represent your brand? Wouldn’t it even draw further negative connotations?
My take on why anyone would be against skateboarding is that in this society that we live in, we all appreciate freedom but we don’t always exercise those freedoms. If you are a skateboarder, fuck man, you are just out there doing what comes to you and what feels right. You are out there being free as a mother fucker. Some people don’t like that much freedom. Sometimes we can talk about freedom, but when you see people being free, it’s kind of too much you know? That kid right there is 14, and fucking he’s got a shit load of confidence and he’s just going to pull himself off the stairs and he’s going to nail it. And for your average kind of low key citizen out there, I guess they see freedom as good to a point. And again I am talking about their opinion. I think you should get as much freedom you can get, you know? Any negatively about skateboarding is generated by people that are fearful of being too free. As far as the logo and the skull, I see it as a very universal thing. Up for interpretation like any piece of art, you know, make no mistake, graphic art is as legitimately as any kind of art. I don’t care if you are doing oil painting, sculpture or whatever the fuck your art form is. It is no better or worse than a skateboard graphic. It’s all creatively and expression. Why I choose the skull was that I saw the skull as a very universal thing. I don’t see it as representing death. I see it to represent the universal experience. This is to say we all have a skull, alive or dead, the skull exists. And so it’s just a universal thing. To me, if you look at skateboarding, if you look at the kind of people that are into skate boarding, it cuts across all kinds of racial, financial, of other barriers. If you hang out in this shop for a day, you will see any kind of people that come in. Different kind of shit that they are interested even outside skateboarding and the thing that ties everyone together is skateboarding. So that universal act of skateboarding spans across a lot of different people and styles, I think it’s well represented for a skull for many reasons. A skull is a really fucking universal thing. Whether you like it or hate it, whether you think it’s satanic of death or whatever, the reality is that you have a skull.
(Everyone laughs)
Sitting on your shoulders, and it’s there, you know what I am saying? I don’t think it is negative at all. At the same time, I do understand that it is a piece of art and it’s open to interpretation. If an individual interpretation of it is negative then they got to take that with them. I can’t explain to every person… That’s also kind of the point of art. The person that creates a piece is always going to feel that piece deeper than the other people that experience it. They have the intention when they create it or what they want to express, but there is something magical about all art where it allows that freedom of the individual to interpret it to fit a meaning that works with where they are at.
What do you think about the current trend of mainstream commercial skateboarding brands where they sign well known skaters only to promote their brands.
I think there’s a lot of HYPE in skateboarding. I don’t mean HYPE in a good word. I mean HYPE as in pumped up. I am down for getting stoked on shit and getting behind stuff and making it large and making people see it and having it be recognized and yet if there’s nothing behind it except what you are using to pop it up with, then what is it? You know what I mean. I think people support our brand because there is a history behind it, because they know we skate and we are behind skateboarding 100%. We are here to no bullshit to stay in business and make a bit of dough if we can, but it’s more than that. And I think a lot of these brands that are out there, they are…
I would have to put it like this, you can only eat McDonalds so many times and then you just need a good home cook meal. I don’t hate McDonalds either I am just saying it’s a different thing. You know what I mean? When somebody puts a can and some love and attention into something that’s going to give you life and sustain you, in the case of food. That’s much different than something that is just produced to make a profit. Right? I know my mom’s Shepard’s pie taste a shit load better than like French fries from McDonalds, I don’t hate it either but I am just saying there’s a difference.
That’s what I am saying. I am not hating any body for doing their business because I don’t want them coming through telling me how to do mine, and I don’t want to carry hate around me because I am just not that kind of person but it’s a different feel to what we got going, you know? The difference to people that can feel it is pretty obvious.
As Skateboarding becomes more and more commercialized and accepted by the public, what is one thing that people must keep in mind, both skaters and skateboard brands out there, in terms of staying true to this hobby.
I think it’s pretty straight forward, if skateboarding… if the act of skateboarding isn’t the basis of everything you do. Then that’s an indication that you are not staying true… you know? I think people that don’t skateboard are really not going to get it; it’s the same thing to art. And what is skateboarding you know? People have different definition of what it is. Is it an art form? Is it a lifestyle? Is it a hobby? Is it a fucking toy that kids play on? I’d say it’s all of these and none of these. It’s whatever the individual makes of it. I think that again, people are going to wear the shoes, they are going to wear the gear, and they are going to support the brands and logo. My logo included man, I sell my shit to people that do not skateboard, but they want to wear my shirt, and I am not mad at them. Over the years,my attitude has changed, you know? In the early days, you skate or you don’t and if you don’t skate- don’t fuck with us and be a poser; you know what I am saying? But as life goes on and you mature you kind of go like, if that kid wants to come in and gives me 2 bucks for a sticker. And put it on his bike or so
mething and he never skates, how can I be mad at that dude man? That kid is supporting me and I also feel that in the case of Skull Skates where we are all about skateboarding but in some ways I feel like we go a bit beyond skate boarding too. Our logo represents culture beyond skate boarding, you know? That can mean a lot of different things man. It can mean b-boying or graph, or punk rock or like art, I mean there’s a lot of shit that I think created by people who are sincere and want to be creative, when that’s what makes it a sub-culture and I think Skull Skates represents a lot of those cultures that go beyond just skateboarding.
Speaking of cultures, Skull Skates is really well received in Japan. How did you guys break i
nto Japan?
Well Japan we already started selling pretty early I mean in the 80s we already had distributors selling it there, but we didn’t truthfully take it too seriously- we just thought it was another country that’s stoked on our brand, obviously we were appreciative but we didn’t understand Japanese culture or the dynamic ofwhat Japanese people were like and that really changed for us in 1992, my friend Tokoshi Uno, who’s born and raised in Japan. I met him at my shop because he was living down here in Vancouver. And my shop was down at Pender and Seymour, downtown core. And it was pretty funny, at one point he just approached me and said dude, I have no idea how to run a shop, like I am clueless about business but I really like your shit and I think I can pull it off. And I was like that was the most honest approach I’ve ever got, because in business, dudes come at you with angles right? They try to pitch you this and that, you can kind of see though that shit after awhile, and they just want what you’ve got and want to take a make out of your thing. I mean that’s a generalization, it’s not in every incident but…When dudes are coming in with some fancy business talk, there’s usually some bullshit behind it. When dudes are like that, when they are clueless but are stoked. I just went like wow, that’s fucking perfect. So, what’s funny about the Japanese shop was that it was totally out there, in the middle of no where, its country side. It’s a trip. He opens at 8 in the evening and stays open till midnight but he’s usually in there till 2 or 3 in the morning. First time I went to hang out there, I think it was 1993 or 1994, I remembered just it was 11:30 almost to midnight and it was out of fucking nowhere and I was just thinking… how does this work? Why did this fucking guy open out here in the middle of nowhere? What’s the point of this? Just as I was thinking about that… 2 vans rolled up, they have just driven like 8 hours from Tokyo, they pile out like between the two vans like 10-12 kids, and they we
re just pilling shit on the counter and each one of them are buying like 500 bucks worth of shit. Our shops is kind of like that in here too, in Canada where you can look around and this is a little bit of a shit hole, there’s nothing too fancy going out here, but you know? People that make it to here, they feel like- it’s a bit of a pilgrimage. It’s not like you can just go to a mall in the corner and buy our shit. You need to put a little bit of effort. It’s like going to score something and your going to go score some Skull Skates shit, right? It’s a little bit undercover and our guy in Japan fully gets our shit, he understands that we are not trying to make a big splash, we are not trying to be the biggest brand, and we are not trying to be crazy rich. What we are trying to do is to keep this going for along time, and he fully gets it. Man, I love Japan just because I really dig Japanese people and I collect robots. I got probably like you know 400-600 Japanese robots. Most of which came from my first trip from Japan actually. My buddy had organized for me, he had a toy shop in his little town that have been there since the 70s, and for 4 days, completely I have filled the stock room, so I came back with 8 fucking goodie boxes full of Japanese robots, and that was a real kick start to my collection, so yea I just dig that shit.
The traditional Japanese culture, I find it very interesting on how Japanese interpret popular culture whether it’s skateboarding, music or art, they kind of give it their own spin. If you ever go see a hip hop crew like I brought this crew from Osaka when we were down. They were called the Low Damage Posse of Osaka, fucking awesome dude! It was 2 DJ’s and one of the DJ’s traded back between MCing and DJing and the other dude just fucking MC’ed, but anyway it was just a sick show. Because it was hip hop but it was Japanese hip hop. Anyway, I love Japan and Japanese people for that reason in that they interrupt what Skull Skates is about in a little bit of a different way than we do here… A very interesting way.
What do you think that is about skate boarding that unites skateboarding in terms of race, sex, gender all type of that.
I think there’s just a- how do you explain it? I think it’s just that feeling you get from skateboarding that is so… it’s so rewarding, you know? I think people that are into it and make it their life or whatever… There’s this feeling that not every body can skateboard, you know what I mean? And not every body is going to put up with falling down and smashing their fucking elbows or all that stuff. So, to some degree, people that skateboard feel like they are part of this society- this secret society or whatever, it’s like the alumni but way fucking cooler you know?
Random Customer: A hive of mind. You know? You see two guys walking down the street. And neither of them are carrying skateboards but know each other skates.
That’s a good point. There’s a feeling about it. For most people it’s a real sense of accomplishment that you can get from skating and it’s like, that could be as something as simple as craving down the streets, or bombing a hill or putting 5 days into learning the most complicated fucked up trick and just digging it and doing it. I think that the reward you get from skating really draws a diverse amount of people into it and I also feel that you know, like I have nothing against hockey and foot ball, but they are pretty regiment, people can inject their own style into the game, but for the most part, you know how a foot ball game and hockey game is played. With skateboarding, it’s so fucking wide open man, it’s so completely wide open as to how you interpret it, and how you do it, and how you make it your own experience. There’s something very appealing about that, regardless of where you’re from or what you are into. It’s like I can take this and make it my own thing. You guys ever mess with graph? The concept of coming up with your own name and creating a name around this, in some way there’s this similarity in graph you have this money to make your own name, and in skateboarding its similar but it’s a different thing. It’s up to you to take and make what you want out of it. And that’s something as simple as rolling up on the sidewalk to the corner store. Or as complex as being a contemporary cutting edge sponsored skater.
Our magazine focuses on different subjects, from DJ’s to musicians to dancers, and one thing we’ve observed is that for DJ’s and musicians, they see the digital age as a change. But looking back at what you are talking about earlier. Skateboarding doesn’t really change, you still grab and skateboard and go right?
How people ride skateboards and the equipment has changed dramatically over the years and yet, the real essence of it, the thing that is hard to nail down in words is that it never changed- it’s timeless. So that kid in the 60’s who rode a clay wheel board down a hill with bear feet and pulled it, like pulled the move and didn’t fucking eat shit and die. That the feeling of the kid back in the 60’s and a kid today who is rolling down the steps doing some technical shit, that feeling is the same for both of ‘em. The feeling stays the same.
Right now, a lot of people are trying to start their own brand, youth especially, what advice do you have to give to those people, and also with starting a brand… At the start you will be like definitely true to what you are doing, once you get up their when it’s get more commercialized, it changes things. What advice do you have to give to these people?
Well if you are only in it for a money, open up a sushi restaurant, and I love sushi but I am just saying if it’s purely a business thing then you know… umm a lot of people from the outside looking at skateboarding, you see these stories in mainstream media and it’s like so much millionaire dollar business or whatever the fuck they are claiming it is these days and that attracts people in because you know- CHA CHING! And people turn into dollar signs. Most of the time, when you come into it without a clue, you are only going to lose a bunch of money; you are not going to make any money. A lot of people that do start sincere, but money has this thing, you know? I think that the capitalist thing we are in, it’s neither bad nor evil, it’s the manipulation of it- it’s the greed that fucks people up. I feel the way that the way I’ve done business here is that that’s a pretty good representation of capitalism, I am not trying to eat anyone in the ear. I am not trying to steal anyone else’s riders or business, you know what I mean? We are just trying to make our little way here. I know people personally that started with nice little brands and the brands have blown up, and there’s nothing wrong with that, but the problem is that if you don’t have some sort of limit or some sort of control on it. Money is going to guarantee fuck things up. It’s just what it does. If the focus… Say you don’t give a fuck about skate boarding and you love money, well, that’s not going to be a long term thing. You might be able to come up with a splashy graphic and al logo that’s tide in and it’s going to impress people for a few years but that’s not going to pan out in the long run. The other thing is where there is danger, if you start sincere, there’s a weird thing about success and that is that people start to think their shit doesn’t stink anymore, you know? Just because they can sell a bit of shit, now they are somehow badass, it’s like dude- you got lucky. There’s nothing wrong about getting lucky but try to get focus, you aint that special you know what I m saying? Haha. I think that’s a danger. When the dough starts flowing and when people love your shit, yea that’s a good feeling. It’s intoxicating in fact and some people get drunk of that and they lose their focus, because it might have started out sincere and then it just becomes a money thing.
What is HYPE?
HYPE to me can mean a few different things. One is used a lot in the skate board word, it’s stoked. That’s just like good times ten and then I suppose from my experience in the skateboard industry, HYPE can potentially have some negative connotations too, that’s kind of what we talked about earlier, I think that when people approach skateboarding as purely a way to make money off skating, then.. HYPE sometimes outweighs substances, meaning it’s all the work they put into pumping something up that doesn’t really have any heart in it… so HYPE to me is going to depend on the context, you know? HYPE to me can mean sort of, a little contrive, artificial, and it can also mean good times ten, just depends on the context.